Author Topic: US/NATO VS Russia  (Read 2196 times)

Offline friendlyfire

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US/NATO VS Russia
« on: January 28, 2022, 03:55:19 PM »
what do you think guys? a train hacking just slow down the Russian buildup in Belarus and EU are threatening to remove the swift code to paralyze Russian financial system.  doomsday clock just 100 sec to midnight
 :(
 
I love the smell of napalm in the morning!

Offline alaeh

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2022, 01:42:05 PM »
NATO expansionism is at the heart of the matter. Russia considers Georgia and Ukraine as "buffer zones" between the West and themselves, by virtue of being next door neighbors. So any attempt to militarize those regions in offering them NATO membership, Russia considers as a direct threat or challenge to its internal security.

To put this in historical perspective, didn't the US also react in similar fashion when Russia established military presence in Cuba which led to the missile crisis in the 60s? Or what if the Chinese decide to establish economic relations with Mexico in exchange for setting up a military presence there, how do you think the Americans will feel and consequently react? The Russians are simply applying their own equivalent of the U.S. Monroe Doctrine.

I think that the best way forward to de-escalate further tensions is for Ukraine to adopt a similar approach taken by Finland (also a next door neighbor of Russia), which is, to become a member of EU and focus solely on its economic initiatives while maintaining neutrality and no longer pursue NATO membership which will only agitate Russia.

I find Professor John Mearsheimer's viewpoint (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrMiSQAGOS4 ) on why Ukraine is more the West's fault (rather than Russia's) to be quite insightful and fully agree with it. If anything, his views seem to have aged frighteningly well considering he made this assessment back in 2015 after Russia's annexation of Crimea. Unfortunately, as he points out, this doesn't seem to be the prevailing conventional wisdom in Washington which poses a real risk of miscalculation. Just because we are in the 21st century it doesn't mean that the rules of balance of power politics no longer apply.

Henry Kissinger seems to share this view as well
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/henry-kissinger-to-settle-the-ukraine-crisis-start-at-the-end/2014/03/05/46dad868-a496-11e3-8466-d34c451760b9_story.html

The Chinese are closely paying attention to this not only because are they next door neighbors with Russia, but they also have their own issues with the U.S. with Taiwan.
https://www.ft.com/content/51a61659-8caf-4abc-aca7-4a6808917089

Offline Mr. Bungle

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2022, 04:26:20 PM »
Putin mentioned in previous interviews that the collapse of the Soviet Union was "the greatest geopolitical tragedy of the 20th century" and moonlighted as a taxi driver in the aftermath. Take it for what it's worth.

Since the fall of the USSR, most of the former Soviet states have always been more inclined to side with the West with the exception of Belarus and maybe some other country that I've overlooked. In the case of Ukraine, when the pro-Russian leader was defeated in the 2014 democratic elections, Putin wasn't happy so Russia invaded Crimea and has been testing and pushing the West's response ever since perhaps in an effort to expose weakness and cracks within the NATO alliance.

More importantly, setting aside what the West and Putin want, we also have to consider what the citizens of the former Eastern-bloc countries' want. NATO doesn't want to budge on its open door policy and the decision to join lies with the people of Ukraine and its sovereignty. The outcome is fairly obvious if things are left as they are so Putin is compelled to do whatever it takes to be in control of the outcome hence the ever present and looming threat to the Eastern European nations in which Russia is perceived as the antagonist as a result.

For me, I just hope all this will only amount to saber rattling and brinkmanship and nothing more.

Offline lahar

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2022, 05:28:46 PM »
I guess we have to look at it from the POV of Russia. Though we also have to understand the experiences of Ukraine and especially Poland when it comes to Russia.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTRUpxtGM44

How it might go down.

https://youtu.be/UNIU6TRsRzk

Offline Taggy

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Offline sandstig

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2022, 03:36:27 AM »
True to form, lots of disinformation in their statement. Just like how their MFA claims they liberated Poland in 1945, glossing over the fact that they invaded Poland together with Germany in 1939, or that they did the same to Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania, who they invaded in 1940.

NATO never promised it would not expand, the only promise they made was that non-German troops would not be stationed in the former East Germany.[1][2][3]

The facts are that Russia invaded Georgia in 2008 and Ukraine in 2014. Nobody in Europe wants to be part of their "sphere of influence", except maybe a few ethnic Russians in eastern Europe.

Saying it's okay for Russia to dictate the foreign policy of its neighbours is as absurd as saying China should be able to do the same about the Philippines.

Offline friendlyfire

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2022, 07:54:46 AM »
i see a china-russia-iran alliance here.
I love the smell of napalm in the morning!

Offline Taggy

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2022, 11:17:47 AM »
can they just settle this like the movie rocky 4?

Offline splerdu

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2022, 01:07:49 AM »
Slightly off-topic since this happened in the South China Sea, but wow this hit seemed a lot harder than what the news stories would have had us believe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGx9FffY0b4
fhtagn

Offline friendlyfire

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2022, 08:40:26 AM »
in us navy every landing is a controlled crash.
I love the smell of napalm in the morning!

Offline Taggy

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2022, 10:23:03 PM »

Offline splerdu

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2022, 11:44:39 PM »
"Since 1979, U.S. Does Not Support Taiwan Independence"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-cG1xOqSzw
fhtagn

Offline lahar

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2022, 07:05:31 PM »
What Will Actually Happen if Russia Invades Ukraine

https://youtu.be/pzvbUpKU4eE

Offline friendlyfire

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2022, 08:36:20 PM »
^ they say that mud will be a great factor in  the invasion
I love the smell of napalm in the morning!

Offline Mr. Bungle

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2022, 10:35:33 PM »
I might be wrong but looks like the invasion's going to happen for real. Russia just needs a pretext and a go signal from Putin.

Offline wheelee

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2022, 11:25:16 PM »
I hope your premonition misses.... but what is written .....

Offline lahar

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #16 on: February 15, 2022, 01:28:27 PM »
Statement of Volodymyr Zelenskyy, President of Ukraine




Offline wheelee

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2022, 03:53:53 PM »
Quote
Feb. 14 (UPI) -- Aides to Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky clarified a statement made Monday as "ironic" in which he declared he had been "told" a Russian invasion would be launched on Wednesday.

Without citing the source of his information, Zelensky on Monday wrote on his personal Facebook page, "We are told that Feb. 16 will be the day of the attack. We will make it the Day of Unity."


https://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-News/2022/02/14/ukraine-russia-invasion-vladimir-putin/8791644839379/

Offline wheelee

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2022, 01:53:53 PM »
...looks like russy is pulling back OR are they??? Hmmmm

Offline Mr. Bungle

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Re: US/NATO VS Russia
« Reply #19 on: February 16, 2022, 02:16:47 PM »
This whole thing is looking like a game of chicken between the West and Putin. Cyberattacks against Ukraine are being reported amid the supposed pull-back of some Russian troops. Meanwhile, majority of Ukrainians still aren't receptive to the idea of being ruled by Putin.